"Kožená" zbroj

Moderátor: maser

mikey.88
ČLEN SPOLKU
Příspěvky: 2718
Registrován: Út 03. Ún 2009 23:42:27
Místo/Bydliště: Praha
Kontaktovat uživatele:

Re: "Kožená" zbroj

Příspěvek od mikey.88 »

http://www.flickr.com/photos/roelipilam ... otostream/

ca. 1300-1360 - 'right rerebrace of cuir bouilli', probably English, The British Museum, London, England

Upper cannon of a right vambrace (rerebrace) of moulded leather. Originally tubular, it has been flattened into its current rounded T-shape. It has a pair of holes at the top for points, a slot with the remains of a leather strap at the centre of the outside edge, and slots for two more at the centre of the inside edge, one containing a strap fragment, where it was originally strapped round the arm. Inside is a separate leather lining, of softer leather, with a repaired cut. The exterior is tooled, stamped, incised and modelled with diaper design of foliage inhabited by birds and mythical two-legged beasts, and a plain border. The upper rear border has been cut off.

Dimensions
Length: 287 millimetres
Width: 245 millimetres
Weight: 228 grammes
Obrázek
mikey.88
ČLEN SPOLKU
Příspěvky: 2718
Registrován: Út 03. Ún 2009 23:42:27
Místo/Bydliště: Praha
Kontaktovat uživatele:

Re: "Kožená" zbroj

Příspěvek od mikey.88 »

arms protection Tartu.jpg
arms protection Tartu.jpg (42.28 KiB) Zobrazeno 8458 x
Arms protection - XIVc. original
The excavations in the medieval part of Tartu in 2000 brought to light an amazing find – from a timber-curbed cesspit (latrine) two wholly preserved leather guards for lower arm, vambraces, strengthened with rows of iron strips and rivets, were discovered. Their leather part is well preserved, some damage can be observed only near elbow. Since the left arm guard wa
s tucked into the right one, it was in somewhat better condition (Figs. 4a, 4b; 5a, b). The prolonged stay in the compact latrine contents had compressed them flat.The conservation of the arm guards was carried out in the laboratory for geoarchaeology and ancient technology of the Institute of History. Before conservation the find was X-ray-photographed (Fig. 6) and the outline of the location of its details was drawn. To eliminate chlorides from metal and leather the find was soaked in distilled water for about six weeks, replacing water every week. The arm guards softened to some extent in water and were easily detached from each other without damaging metal details. At the elbow of the left arm guard fungous and bacterial damage could be observed, as a result of which a part of leather was destroyed (Figs. 4a, 4b). The damage on the right arm guard was of a smaller extent – leather was wholly preserved but considerably darkened and deformed. In the damage of leather the chemical effect of the environment also played an important role. The complete rusting of iron details was evidently advanced by the high acidity of the leather. After the elimination/removal of chlorides the armour details were soaked in the solution of PEG 400 with ethanol additive during three weeks to compensate to some extent the decrease of tannin in leather. Owing to the prolonged soaking of arm guards in water and PEG solution they somewhat softened and it became possible partly to restore their original shape. Iron details were mechanically cleaned. Loose details were glued to their places with acetone glue made of acrylic polymer Paraloid B-72. Next, metal was treated with water solution of tannin with the addition of ethanol and a little ortophosphoric acid. Beeswax softened to creamy consistence in turpentine was used to cover the metal details treated with tannin solution. The arm guards from Tartu are most likely made of thicker skin of horse's withers in the technique of cuir bouilli (boiled leather). Stiff objects with persistent shape are made of leather tanned with tannic substances (herbal tanning) by scalding it at 75–90 oC in water trough. After drying the shape of the object will persist but leather loses its elasticity, becomes stiff and hard, while the shrinking is low owing to the saturation with tannins. The leather parts of the arm guards of Tartu were probably made in this way. First the craftsman cut the blanks from tanned leather. Then the process of cuir bouilli and the shaping of arm guards followed, after which they were most likely left to dry on a special last. Then metal details were riveted to the leather base – steel strips alternately with rows of rivets, and also buckles. Arm guards were most likely also treated with wax or grease (evidently repeatedly throughout the period of their use) to make them weatherproof. The reason why completely whole arm guards were discarded will remain uncertain, as well as the place of their manufacture and, of course, the armourer who made them. The possible place of manufacture may be Tartu or Tallinn, or perhaps some German town. For example in Tallinn arm guards for upper and lower arms, evidently made of leather (Armleder, Actearmleder), are mentioned among the defence equipment distributed by town authorities to males in about 1360. Since the find from Tartu is the first discovery of medieval leather arm guards in Europe, it is quite difficult to define them temporally and typologically. Only medieval works of art, where warriors and their armours are sometimes drawn quite in detail, can be used for a comparable source. On the basis of works of art, preserved primarily in Germany, we may presume that analogous arm guards were used already in 1330s, but the closest parallels to the Tartu find date from the final decades of the 14th century. It is possible that such vambraces were sporadically still used at the beginning of the 15th century. The rare leather arm guards are stored in the Town Museum
of Tartu (A-115:1209 and A-115:1265).


Našel jsem to u člověka jménem Radosław Sergot na Facebooku :) Takže jen to házím sem, kdyby to někdo neviděl.

Mikey
Obrázek
Zdeslav
ČLEN SPOLKU
Příspěvky: 2457
Registrován: Ne 24. Srp 2008 14:46:17
Místo/Bydliště: Praha
Kontaktovat uživatele:

Re: "Kožená" zbroj

Příspěvek od Zdeslav »

Velmi zajímavé. Takže to vypadá, že se ty železné proužky nenýtovaly střídavě zezhora a zespoda, ale že se dělal střídavě kovový proužek a řada nýtů. A taky to bylo vařené. Asi v brzké době zkusím udělat "repliku" :)
Nezabud hrr!
Avátar uživatele
Czernozub
Příspěvky: 818
Registrován: So 27. Ún 2010 12:49:06
Místo/Bydliště: Želiv, Tábor
Kontaktovat uživatele:

Re: "Kožená" zbroj

Příspěvek od Czernozub »

Možná to jen i tehdy ojebali...
"Neorganizovaná banda není armádou o nic víc, než hromada cihel domem."
Sókratés
Avátar uživatele
Klinštejn
Příspěvky: 1324
Registrován: Pá 03. Dub 2009 22:18:17
Místo/Bydliště: Den Kalla Norden
Kontaktovat uživatele:

Re: "Kožená" zbroj

Příspěvek od Klinštejn »

Výborně, jestli tam byly jen řady nýtků bez železa, tak se mé ojebové nátepníky stávají méně ojebovými :D
Obrázek Det finns alltid hopp..
Avátar uživatele
Valkoun
ČLEN SPOLKU
Příspěvky: 1111
Registrován: Stř 10. Zář 2008 17:27:16
Kontaktovat uživatele:

Re: "Kožená" zbroj

Příspěvek od Valkoun »

Když se řádně podíváte, tak na tom jediném levém horním, kde je vidět dovnitř, jsou 2 řady nýtů bez hlaviček. Těžko by svrchní hlavičky nýtů, natož přinýtované pásky drželi bez hlavičky nebo "placky" uvnitř. Po odrezlých svrchních páscích zůstaly stopy, na 20% zadní strany kterou vidíme holt ne. Ale je nesmysl dělat závěry jen z fotografie :D

Počkejte až bude víc fotek.
Nezabudovi Sláva!
Zdeslav
ČLEN SPOLKU
Příspěvky: 2457
Registrován: Ne 24. Srp 2008 14:46:17
Místo/Bydliště: Praha
Kontaktovat uživatele:

Re: "Kožená" zbroj

Příspěvek od Zdeslav »

Valkoune, my neděláme závěry z fotografie. Čteme přiložený text ;)
Nezabud hrr!
Kordulka
Příspěvky: 1633
Registrován: Út 20. Led 2009 20:46:24
Kontaktovat uživatele:

Re: "Kožená" zbroj

Příspěvek od Kordulka »

Podařilo se mi najít i článek k dataci oněch tartských latrin: http://www.kirj.ee/public/Archaeology/2 ... -16-29.pdf

A ještě pár detailů nalezených nátepníků: http://terra-teutonica.ru/topic1333.html
Zdeslav
ČLEN SPOLKU
Příspěvky: 2457
Registrován: Ne 24. Srp 2008 14:46:17
Místo/Bydliště: Praha
Kontaktovat uživatele:

Re: "Kožená" zbroj

Příspěvek od Zdeslav »

Kordulka: Pěkně! :thumbup:
Nezabud hrr!
Kordulka
Příspěvky: 1633
Registrován: Út 20. Led 2009 20:46:24
Kontaktovat uživatele:

Re: "Kožená" zbroj

Příspěvek od Kordulka »

V tom ruském odkazu je tak detailní popis, že to je v podstatě návod na výrobu těch nátepníků 8-)
A zaujalo mě, že byly použity "novodobé" rozklepávací nýty - zvenku hlavička a zespodu takový ten "kalíšek" (omlouvám se za nepřesné výrazivo). Jak to vyráběli, to mi rozum nebere; naši předkové nám asi připraví ještě mnohá překvapení...
Odpovědět

Kdo je online

Uživatelé prohlížející si toto fórum: Nejsou tu žádní registrovaní uživatelé a 5 hostů